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Old 01/09/2018, 08:23 AM   #3126
JZinCO
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Originally Posted by McPuff View Post
Just checked these out. Look pretty cool and very small footprint. I could easily do 6 of these for my 300 for just about $350. I have sent an inquiry to the company, but it seems like a good option potentially. I may just buy one for my lagoon to test it out. The warranty is pretty great, just not sure if they are dimmable at all. These are the kind of reef lighting solutions I'd like to see more of. In my opinion a reef light does not need to cost three arms and 5 legs to be effective. Black box LEDs have shown this. More industrial solutions may not look as elegant but if they get the job done then I'm happy (my lights are/will be hidden anyway). :0)
Yeah, the lamps are a few $ more than typical HD home-security lights but the price differential is because less common LED chips cost more. This company has the same markup as typical retail, which is likely less than markup for specialty hobbies (we're paying for product development costs plus parts and labor).
Honestly though, I don't know anyone who has ran basic lighting like this so it is risky in that sense. Ask the vendor is they are UL rated, because that would be a step above marsaqua.

Hope I'm not derailing. It's just I prefer a whiter color temp and I find there are few lights out there that aren't crisp with high color rendition at a <$300 range. On top of that I will have a 72x30 footprint to cover so I'm not sure if fixtures with 24x24 light spread will do. Or maybe with a 30" surface-to-sandbed depth they might spread enough? But still I need enough PAR to grow sea grasses. I find it confusing and frustrating so it's funny that you enjoyed your window shopping Michael. Michael, did you find any LED fixtures that caught your eye?


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Old 01/09/2018, 08:28 AM   #3127
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Those led flood lights are the cheap generic ones you can buy on eBay for half of what they’re asking in 21led. They’re really bright, but not sure how long they’ll last. I bought a 100w (2 x 50w chips) flood light for my landlords house and one of the drivers failed after a few months of use (4ish hours of use a day). It caused one of the LED’s to flicker/strobe.


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Old 01/09/2018, 08:43 AM   #3128
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Sam, I think youre referring to a different company's lights. I couldn't find any other companies with this style housing using chips with >6500K temp. And 21ledusa's options range from 10w to 50w.
Still good to know, and it should be noted that others often replace the drivers on this style of light with a more reliable driver. Again not defending 21ledusa. They do have mixed reviews (as do all of the chinese fixtures) but I'd rather criticize particular companies because a competitor might use different components, even if from the same factory.


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Old 01/09/2018, 09:54 AM   #3129
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Derail away! I welcome the discussion. Since I've been looking around for this stuff, it's nice to find some right here on my thread! It's also cool to hear different points of view regarding cheap versus pricey lighting solutions.

I often lean towards the cheap side, but for this kind of thing, I'm feeling myself gravitating towards the fancy stuff. Having quality components like circuitry, controllers, reflectors, lenses, heat sinks, fans, and the LEDs themselves is a lot to consider. I also like the ability to change or replace components to get it 'just so', as well as being able to keep it running for years. I don't like to just throw stuff away and replace it. I've got a hot tub I've had for seventeen years. I've repaired and replaced components many times to keep it running. I get great satisfaction from that.

A few have caught my eye, but I'm not ready to buy anything. Plus I bounce back and forth between looking for something to replace my metal halide in my current tank, and looking for a setup for my next tank.


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Old 01/09/2018, 10:31 AM   #3130
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I bounce back and forth between looking for something to replace my metal halide in my current tank, and looking for a setup for my next tank.
For your next tank, do you have a plan of action for how you will go about populating it? I'm curious about the order that you would work in since there is not already an existing ecosystem in place. Would you start with the micro level and work up, macro down, or a mixture that work in concert to keep things balanced?

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Old 01/09/2018, 10:43 AM   #3131
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Here’s a link to a very similar one for half the price:
https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?m...2F332266192577
The only difference I see is the front metal cover screws into the front side instead of the backside. And chip color options..

From my experience, the quality is all the same for the “Chinese” ,for the lack of a better word, low buck lights. I’d make an exception for the black box versions as they are pretty good quality-wise. I’ve owned a few of the reefbreeders knockoffs and they are very good for the money.

You’re right about the company being able to put the units together them-self with better internals, but it’s a crap shoot when it’s not specifically listed which leads me to believe it’s generic.

I ended up with a similar model that had 2 50w chips. They’re great for the price; on eBay, but not sure how well they’d do over an aquarium.

Build quality break down:
I took the broken one apart to identify the issue to see if I could easily fix it. The power supply was what died. They ended up giving me a refund. I think I paid $47 for two 100w flood lights (w/o plugs). I’ll have to check.

The housing is a piece of molded aluminum
The reflector is a very thin molded aluminum- thinner that a pie pan and very shallow; maybe 1” high
Glass front cover is dyed black around the clear opening and has a silicone lip piped along the upper surface edge that creates the seal when the metal rim is screwed into the unit.
Generic LED screwed to the housing and power supply glued to housing
External hardware all slowly rusted living outdoors after 6mo.
Light never leaked or condensated and was never more than warm to the touch which I couldn’t believe because LED’s get hot!

I’m not sure how well the extremely wide reflector would penetrate or work without a lot of spillage unless mounted very close to the water, which could start the rust issue.

The 21led website probably puts them together with various parts which is why they offer different chip colors. It would be very easy to swap out with a different colored chip if you wanted to do it yourself.

My perfectly calibrated Kelvin eye would call their “6500” a 10k in the hobby or cool white for the rest of the generic led world. lol


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Old 01/09/2018, 12:11 PM   #3132
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Thanks Sam for your thoughts. Certainly alot to consider. Like I said, it gets confusing fast, dealing with all of the variety of fixture setups and price differences. My only experience is: the cheap stuff (e.g. current usa marine orbit) that I discarded within a year and the decent low end stuff (running two marsaqua and two unbranded blackboxes of which one channel died). Looking for something that'll actually last the 50,000 or so hour lifetime of the diodes, while being affordable, is harder than it ought to be.
Might just pony up for the sb reef photon torpedo
https://sbreeflights.com/photon-torp...led-light.html


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Old 01/09/2018, 02:56 PM   #3133
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Thanks Sam for your thoughts. Certainly alot to consider. Like I said, it gets confusing fast, dealing with all of the variety of fixture setups and price differences. My only experience is: the cheap stuff (e.g. current usa marine orbit) that I discarded within a year and the decent low end stuff (running two marsaqua and two unbranded blackboxes of which one channel died). Looking for something that'll actually last the 50,000 or so hour lifetime of the diodes, while being affordable, is harder than it ought to be.
Might just pony up for the sb reef photon torpedo
https://sbreeflights.com/photon-torp...led-light.html


You sir are in the same boat I was in. Lol Except I’m in the little dinghy pulled behind the yacht now. Haha
I had to google how to spell yacht.. Lmao yaght, yaught? ******

I started out making my own led lights over the 5 gal, then bought a used current USA orbit marine led, then a new evergrow it2040 16” black box, then a used evergrow it2060 24” black box where I replaced all the led’s, then another used it2040 16” for the new cube and now decided to splurge on a used radion g2 with g3 pro upgrade and reeflink. Haha I might upgrade to a g3 pro if I can find a good deal!
Slowly making my way up to the elite level. Haha

Send me one of those torpedo light-speed photon blasters while you’re at it! I’ll pm you my address. Lmao


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Old 01/09/2018, 06:08 PM   #3134
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Good question, SereneAquatic.

I don't really have any real plans for the next tank. It's more like day dreams really. But if I were, I'd start with dirt, sand, live sand and live rock. Then detrivores, snails and plants. Pretty much the same advice I gave to you.

I wouldn't worry too much about not following my recommendations. We all come into this hobby from different angles, and any of them can be successful. Right now, I'd say prepare for your algae invasion. Everybody gets one. It's how you handle this ordeal that will set the tone. Best of luck! Let me know if I can help.


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Old 01/09/2018, 06:49 PM   #3135
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JZ, those SB reef lights are very impressive. Reading their info, they really seem to know their stuff, matching up spectrums to different needs. Even their fresh water plant fixtures look killer. I'm so stoked to learn of so many options I never heard of.

One thing I've noticed, is that some have gone through several cheaper options. In my experience, that road often ends up to be more expensive. Dat ain't me…


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Old 01/10/2018, 06:22 AM   #3136
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Thanks Sam for your thoughts. Certainly alot to consider. Like I said, it gets confusing fast, dealing with all of the variety of fixture setups and price differences. My only experience is: the cheap stuff (e.g. current usa marine orbit) that I discarded within a year and the decent low end stuff (running two marsaqua and two unbranded blackboxes of which one channel died). Looking for something that'll actually last the 50,000 or so hour lifetime of the diodes, while being affordable, is harder than it ought to be.
Might just pony up for the sb reef photon torpedo
https://sbreeflights.com/photon-torp...led-light.html
I suppose I could run 3 of the 500W torpedos over my 300gal. :0) Might have to run them at about 20% or less. Should get good lifespan with that intensity. :0)


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Old 01/10/2018, 06:06 PM   #3137
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hahaha

Micheal, you may be interested in this.
I debated, considered radions xr15w pro, hydras 26, or Euroquatics Angel. All are roughly comparable and all would work. But I'm going to go with rapid led. They have one sleek fixture, the Corona (which replaced the Onyx). It'd cost around the same ($1200/3 units) and I like it but they partnered with a company for their controller and this company has not satisfied it's kickstarter backers. Considering that there are no physical controls on the unit and user-settings are stored on the cloud, the risk of a company going under and losing light control is unacceptable. Instead, I'm going with their DIY kit for 3 units in series and a 6-channel controller that doesn't require WiFi/WPS, all for under $1000. Based on your previous experiences with different bulbs and their unique spectra, I think you'd get a kick out of multi-channel control. It ought to do the trick. And for giggles, one can plug in lat/long to recreate seasonal sun cycles, as well as moon cycles. A Caribbean tank, just plug in Key Largo, FL. Even neater, their $200 controller plugs uses WiFi to plug in and replicate the real-time weather of a location. Of course those things are secondary. And hopefully the experience of soldering the light together will give the intimate knowledge needed when a component fails.


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Old 01/10/2018, 10:01 PM   #3138
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That's sounds way cool JZ! Getting high end stuff for cheaper by DIYing is the ultimate combo.

Yes, the multi channel control of LEDs is a big attraction for sure. Recreating specific sun and moon cycles sounds amazing! You know what else would be cool, and I think I've heard of this, would be to recreate the path of the sun (and moon) across the tank. Light and shadows would change throughout the day, just like in nature!

I'd very much like to follow your progress on the DIY kit. Can you share your experience?


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Old 01/10/2018, 10:40 PM   #3139
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My new fish came yesterday! Just five minutes before they arrived, my wife tripped and fell, fracturing her arm. So, with no other alternative, I had to leave the box unopened, and drive her to the ER.

Several hours later we returned home, and I began acclimating twelve fish that had been in rather small bags for much longer than is ideal. Long story short, all but one is accounted for, and I haven't found it dead, so it may just be hiding out. I'm crossing my fingers.

Whew! That was insanely stressful! I now have six chalk bass in one QT and five (or six) royal grammas in another. Both tanks are setup with hypo salinity conditions. Today they look good and are eating. If all goes well, they should be ready for the big show in the third week of February. Woohoo!


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Old 01/10/2018, 11:35 PM   #3140
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Dang, hope the wife feels better! You don’t think she did it on purpose do you?... :scratcheshead:

She knew more fish were coming and knows how obsessed you are with the fish! Seems like a stunt my wife might pull... haha

Can’t wait to see the new fishies swimming around in the display!


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Old 01/11/2018, 05:53 AM   #3141
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Congrats on getting your new fish in your QT tanks alive and hopefully well (sounds like it). Sorry to hear about your wife's fractured arm. Family comes first, always.


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Old 01/11/2018, 08:29 AM   #3142
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hahaha

Micheal, you may be interested in this.
I debated, considered radions xr15w pro, hydras 26, or Euroquatics Angel. All are roughly comparable and all would work. But I'm going to go with rapid led. They have one sleek fixture, the Corona (which replaced the Onyx). It'd cost around the same ($1200/3 units) and I like it but they partnered with a company for their controller and this company has not satisfied it's kickstarter backers. Considering that there are no physical controls on the unit and user-settings are stored on the cloud, the risk of a company going under and losing light control is unacceptable. Instead, I'm going with their DIY kit for 3 units in series and a 6-channel controller that doesn't require WiFi/WPS, all for under $1000. Based on your previous experiences with different bulbs and their unique spectra, I think you'd get a kick out of multi-channel control. It ought to do the trick. And for giggles, one can plug in lat/long to recreate seasonal sun cycles, as well as moon cycles. A Caribbean tank, just plug in Key Largo, FL. Even neater, their $200 controller plugs uses WiFi to plug in and replicate the real-time weather of a location. Of course those things are secondary. And hopefully the experience of soldering the light together will give the intimate knowledge needed when a component fails.
I'm fairly certain you can still operate the Corona with apex... is this not true? If your point holds true then I would also avoid the Corona due to their dependency on another technology.

I will say that I like rapidled a lot as a company. They have terrific customer service, quality products, and their warranties are great. I've got the Onyx fixtures and am generally happy with them but would like to have greater coverage. Adding two more fixtures would be about perfect but they are hard to find now.


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Old 01/11/2018, 10:47 AM   #3143
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I'd very much like to follow your progress on the DIY kit. Can you share your experience?
I think I will buy it sooner than later, because I can use the same fixture on my current tank. Currently emailing back and forth with rapid led to figure out lighting. So I will keep you informed. Spending a grand on a hobby at once will be a tough pill to swallow.. but hey I guess that's why I made a budget for my upcoming build.


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Old 01/11/2018, 10:53 AM   #3144
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McPuff, if you had a footprint of 72 x 24, how many Corona units would you put on, considering you want to house anything from mixed coral to seagrasses?

I emailed them the following as well: "On another note, it looks like all controllability of the Corona depends on the Fishbit controller. I'm concerned about that company based on responses of their initial backers and others who made pre-orders and have waited 1-3 years with little communication. Is there anything to reassure me? Will Rapid Led help Corona owners if transition to another controller/app is required?"

----

Michael, I can't wait to see photos of those fish.


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Old 01/11/2018, 10:58 AM   #3145
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Sam, it was clearly my wife's most diabolical scheme yet to thwart my efforts!

Thanks Kevin. She's getting better everyday, and it gives me the chance to repay all the times she's had to nurse me back to health, over the years.


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Old 01/11/2018, 11:09 AM   #3146
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JZinCO, I would think building your lights would warrant starting a dedicated thread to it. You could start one in the DIY forum. I'm sure a LOT of folks would be very interested in your experience. It kinda sounds like you're starting up a new tank, so it could be part of a new tank build thread. Whatever you decide, I look forward to following!

McPuff, that's good to know, regarding RapidLED's customer service, etc. Knowing you'll have good company support after purchase is pretty important, especially given all the options and components.


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Old 01/12/2018, 07:36 AM   #3147
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McPuff, if you had a footprint of 72 x 24, how many Corona units would you put on, considering you want to house anything from mixed coral to seagrasses?
That is a tricky one actually. I think you could get by with 3 of but you'd want to keep the t5 to fill in the gaps. I have 4 over my 72 x 36 footprint and the edges are all pretty dim. I would need 6 to adequately cover it. There is another thread on here (another 300DD) where the guy has just that.

With 24" front to back the Corona should have enough spread to cover it well. But I do think you'd want to go with 4 units min. If you can swing 6 of them you'll be able to run them at a much lower intensity and have TERRIFIC coverage without t5s. When I had the 120, 4 of the Onyx units were really good. This is the main problem with LED on large tanks... just need so many to do a good job.


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Old 01/12/2018, 11:11 AM   #3148
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Thanks for your thoughts McPuff.

Gonna start a new thread rather than keeping Michael's thread off topic.

edit: http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2664175



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Old 01/12/2018, 01:21 PM   #3149
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JZ, I didn't mean to run you off, though after re-reading my last post, I can see why you might think that I did. Sorry. I've really enjoyed the discussion. I was suggesting a DIY build thread, so more people could find it and join in, rather than just us oddballs in the plant section.

Thanks for the link! I'll be following.


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Old 01/12/2018, 02:14 PM   #3150
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No worries. Thought I could bring in a wider audience and also was trying to be courteous to you. Didn't feel I had to move the discussion off your thread at all.


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